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Which of the advanced stats out there are useful in determining the abilities of pure defensive defencemen? Are there any? Plus Minus is garbage obviously.

 

I am just curious as to if there is anyone we could potentially add to this team that could be otherwise underrated as a purely defensive defenceman. Ya know, some moneyball shit. 

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Roman Polak.  We had him

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That 7th time is always such a doozie though.

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Advanced stats for defense

1. Shot suppression

2. Zone exits

3. Breakups of zone entries

4. Quality of competition 

5. Corsi-relative 

6. High danger scoring chances against

7. Zone entries against 

I generally look at these stats combined to get a picture of defense. You look at how many plays they break up and how well they translate that into turning the puck up ice to the forwards.

 

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There is no one stat that you can go to. I would also try and erase the idea of defensive defensemen from your mind. The game has evolved a lot and moved away from defensive/shut down defensemen (e.g. Scott Stevens) and purely offensive defensemen (e.g. Letang) to more hybrids (Hedman, Karlsson, etc.).

That said, you're looking for defensemen that drive possession (positive CORSI). You can sort CORSI (CF%) for all sorts of situations/positions/etc., here: https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerteams.php?season=20172018&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=n&team=ALL&pos=D&loc=B&toi=200&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=82&lines=single

The problem is that, in the role you're describing, these guys would typically be matched up against the other team's top forwards, who tend to drive possession for their own team. They try to balance this by indexing CORSI against something called QOC (Quality of Competition). This is in and of itself an okay metric, but becomes harder to rank guys.

I generally use natural stat trick to look at the ratio of puck possession (CF%, puck possession), and on-ice scoring chances and goal scoring ratios (SCF%, GF%). Take a look at each of them, and you'll start to see some common names near the top of the list... and the bottom of the list.

Also worth noting that a lot of the "go to" sites have taken away a lot of their functionality and/or restricted it to premium access... meaning you have to pay.

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5 hours ago, gibby said:

There is no one stat that you can go to. I would also try and erase the idea of defensive defensemen from your mind. The game has evolved a lot and moved away from defensive/shut down defensemen (e.g. Scott Stevens) and purely offensive defensemen (e.g. Letang) to more hybrids (Hedman, Karlsson, etc.).

That said, you're looking for defensemen that drive possession (positive CORSI). You can sort CORSI (CF%) for all sorts of situations/positions/etc., here: https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerteams.php?season=20172018&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=n&team=ALL&pos=D&loc=B&toi=200&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=82&lines=single

The problem is that, in the role you're describing, these guys would typically be matched up against the other team's top forwards, who tend to drive possession for their own team. They try to balance this by indexing CORSI against something called QOC (Quality of Competition). This is in and of itself an okay metric, but becomes harder to rank guys.

I generally use natural stat trick to look at the ratio of puck possession (CF%, puck possession), and on-ice scoring chances and goal scoring ratios (SCF%, GF%). Take a look at each of them, and you'll start to see some common names near the top of the list... and the bottom of the list.

Also worth noting that a lot of the "go to" sites have taken away a lot of their functionality and/or restricted it to premium access... meaning you have to pay.

That looks like hieroglyphics to me...

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13 hours ago, shovhd said:

That looks like hieroglyphics to me...

I mean... you can break it down into the essence of what these stats mean.

GOOD CORSI  = When player is on ice, his team usually has puck. BAD CORSI = When player is on ice, other team usually has puck.

GOOD SCF% = When player is on ice, his team generates more scoring chances than they give up.

GOOD GF% = When player is on ice, his team scores more goals than they give up.

The thing to keep in mind with all of these stats is that they can be misleading when you look at small samples (one game, or even just a few games).

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Get a subscription to The Athletic.

Very advanced stat focused reporting, but written in a way that makes it easy to understand.

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3 hours ago, Ryan said:

Get a subscription to The Athletic.

Very advanced stat focused reporting, but written in a way that makes it easy to understand.

I would entirely second this. The Athletic is the best way to read sports.. especially hockey. It's also well worth the money.

I do think CYS is looking to dink around on his own though... The Athletic is good, but you're at the mercy of whatever the author chooses to write about at the Athletic. If nobody is writing about defensive metrics, at the time he is interested, it doesn't do him much good.

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